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	<title>Comments on: Where Are The World Cup Goals?</title>
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	<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/</link>
	<description>A soccer blog featuring essays, news and photography exploring soccer around the world</description>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-25428</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jul 2010 05:07:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-25428</guid>
		<description>Just a note on World Cup tournament formats: no format has been used more than four times, and here&#039;s the rundown:

1930: Four groups of 4 (though 3 teams declined, so it ended up being one of 4 and three of 3), group winners advancing to knockout semifinals/final (including the United States!)

1934-38: Sixteen-team direct knockout, draws after 120 minutes replayed (only 15 teams in 1938 as Austria qualified, but was swallowed up by Nazi Germany).

1950: Four groups of four, group winners advancing to final group stage (the &quot;final&quot; that year was only possible as such because of Uruguay and Brazil&#039;s earlier results; also, two groups were short: Sweden&#039;s and Uruguay&#039;s, due to withdrawals; Uruguay only had to play one game to make the final round robin and duly thrashed Bolivia 8-0.)

1954: Four groups of four, but with two seeds in each group that did not play each other (the two non-seeded didn&#039;t play each other, either), but a scheduled group play-off as necessary; the two best teams advanced to three-round knockout stage.

1958-70: The &quot;classic&quot; format: four groups of four, top two going to knockout quarterfinals etc.

1974-78: Four groups of four, top two going to second group stage, second stage winners going to final and runner-up going to third-place match.

1982: Six groups of four, top two in each going to second group stage with four groups of three, winners of which advanced to knockout semifinals/final.

1986-94: Six groups of four, top two in each plus four best third-place teams advancing to 16-team single-elimination knockout stage.

1998-2010: &quot;New classic&quot; format: eight groups of four, top two in each advancing to 16-team knockout stage.

This last has been used four times...guess it&#039;s time to change again! ^_^</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a note on World Cup tournament formats: no format has been used more than four times, and here&#8217;s the rundown:</p>
<p>1930: Four groups of 4 (though 3 teams declined, so it ended up being one of 4 and three of 3), group winners advancing to knockout semifinals/final (including the United States!)</p>
<p>1934-38: Sixteen-team direct knockout, draws after 120 minutes replayed (only 15 teams in 1938 as Austria qualified, but was swallowed up by Nazi Germany).</p>
<p>1950: Four groups of four, group winners advancing to final group stage (the &#8220;final&#8221; that year was only possible as such because of Uruguay and Brazil&#8217;s earlier results; also, two groups were short: Sweden&#8217;s and Uruguay&#8217;s, due to withdrawals; Uruguay only had to play one game to make the final round robin and duly thrashed Bolivia 8-0.)</p>
<p>1954: Four groups of four, but with two seeds in each group that did not play each other (the two non-seeded didn&#8217;t play each other, either), but a scheduled group play-off as necessary; the two best teams advanced to three-round knockout stage.</p>
<p>1958-70: The &#8220;classic&#8221; format: four groups of four, top two going to knockout quarterfinals etc.</p>
<p>1974-78: Four groups of four, top two going to second group stage, second stage winners going to final and runner-up going to third-place match.</p>
<p>1982: Six groups of four, top two in each going to second group stage with four groups of three, winners of which advanced to knockout semifinals/final.</p>
<p>1986-94: Six groups of four, top two in each plus four best third-place teams advancing to 16-team single-elimination knockout stage.</p>
<p>1998-2010: &#8220;New classic&#8221; format: eight groups of four, top two in each advancing to 16-team knockout stage.</p>
<p>This last has been used four times&#8230;guess it&#8217;s time to change again! ^_^</p>
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		<title>By: Fredrik Stael von Holstein</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24854</link>
		<dc:creator>Fredrik Stael von Holstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jun 2010 13:41:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24854</guid>
		<description>Tom: uyuff!! That&#039;s a rather huge task, but certainly something that the media should pick-up... Thinking of starting a Facebook Group: &quot;FIFA: make the game more attractive&quot; (or something)...!

Anders: I absolutely agree with you. However, that does not explain the decline (in goals scored per game) during the past two decades... But again: the ball is messing things up. Besides, as I understand, many games are played on high altitude. The combination is, maybe, not the best?

Best regards from Barcelona (no: I am a Real Madrid fan  - since I was a small kid! And no: I don&#039;t like the new era of &quot;Galácticos&quot;!!)!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom: uyuff!! That&#8217;s a rather huge task, but certainly something that the media should pick-up&#8230; Thinking of starting a Facebook Group: &#8220;FIFA: make the game more attractive&#8221; (or something)&#8230;!</p>
<p>Anders: I absolutely agree with you. However, that does not explain the decline (in goals scored per game) during the past two decades&#8230; But again: the ball is messing things up. Besides, as I understand, many games are played on high altitude. The combination is, maybe, not the best?</p>
<p>Best regards from Barcelona (no: I am a Real Madrid fan  &#8211; since I was a small kid! And no: I don&#8217;t like the new era of &#8220;Galácticos&#8221;!!)!</p>
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		<title>By: Anders Hjort</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24811</link>
		<dc:creator>Anders Hjort</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jun 2010 20:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24811</guid>
		<description>I actually believe the new WC-ball carries some of the blame for the decline in goals. The ball seems lively and way too light. Very often attackers lose the ball in the deciding moment because it&#039;s too hard to control. It bounces off the field when passed across the pitch and shots from a far go over the goal. Take another look at the Spain- Switzerland game: 

http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&amp;videoid=105484191  

Villa&#039;s shot at 3.06 - 9/10 times he would put that away with a regular ball.
check also Torres&#039; shot at 3.21 - I have never seen him make a chip as aweful as this - look at it in slow, it seems like the ball just takes off on its own. Xabi Alonso&#039;s shot at 3.41 is unbelievable, but again look at how the ball bounces during the pass to him.

I find it funny that the ball was made for strikers, made to make goals nicer, made to give tecnically strong players an advantage, and so far we see frustrated super stars and lower seated countries stealing headlines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I actually believe the new WC-ball carries some of the blame for the decline in goals. The ball seems lively and way too light. Very often attackers lose the ball in the deciding moment because it&#8217;s too hard to control. It bounces off the field when passed across the pitch and shots from a far go over the goal. Take another look at the Spain- Switzerland game: </p>
<p><a href="http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&#038;videoid=105484191" rel="nofollow">http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&#038;videoid=105484191</a>  </p>
<p>Villa&#8217;s shot at 3.06 &#8211; 9/10 times he would put that away with a regular ball.<br />
check also Torres&#8217; shot at 3.21 &#8211; I have never seen him make a chip as aweful as this &#8211; look at it in slow, it seems like the ball just takes off on its own. Xabi Alonso&#8217;s shot at 3.41 is unbelievable, but again look at how the ball bounces during the pass to him.</p>
<p>I find it funny that the ball was made for strikers, made to make goals nicer, made to give tecnically strong players an advantage, and so far we see frustrated super stars and lower seated countries stealing headlines.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24767</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jun 2010 21:53:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24767</guid>
		<description>I think its a combination of the jabuani ball and the very slick pitches making play very difficult and thus harder to create clear cut chances. The high altitudes and vuvuzelas can&#039;t help either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think its a combination of the jabuani ball and the very slick pitches making play very difficult and thus harder to create clear cut chances. The high altitudes and vuvuzelas can&#8217;t help either.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Dunmore</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24689</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Dunmore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 18:39:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24689</guid>
		<description>Fred, get your calculator out! I need some help.... ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fred, get your calculator out! I need some help&#8230;. <img src='http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Fredrik Stael von Holstein</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24684</link>
		<dc:creator>Fredrik Stael von Holstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 17:32:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24684</guid>
		<description>Agreed!

Goals per minute is what it should really be!!

;-)

Fred</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed!</p>
<p>Goals per minute is what it should really be!!</p>
<p> <img src='http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Fred</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Dunmore</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24680</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Dunmore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 17:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24680</guid>
		<description>Fredrik: I agree with the general point, but it&#039;s not always been that way either. Compare 1954 to 2010: with eight groups of four teams in 2010, for example, there will be 48 guaranteed group games, 75% of the total. In the 1954 World Cup, there were 16 group games (plus two playoff games) and 8 knockout games. So again, 75% of the total.  Some World Cups in old times also went straight to a knockout stage. Yet 1954 saw the highest goals per game average of all tournaments, at 5.4!

So the format&#039;s varied over time, sometimes there were those second group stages, sometimes there weren&#039;t.  In general, then, I do think you bring up an important point what we would need ideally would be a goals-per-minute total. That&#039;s a lot of adding up and dividing to do, though!

Plus, I&#039;d add the format has remained the same since 1998, yet the number of goals will have gone down substantially in three successive World Cups, if 2010 continues its trend.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fredrik: I agree with the general point, but it&#8217;s not always been that way either. Compare 1954 to 2010: with eight groups of four teams in 2010, for example, there will be 48 guaranteed group games, 75% of the total. In the 1954 World Cup, there were 16 group games (plus two playoff games) and 8 knockout games. So again, 75% of the total.  Some World Cups in old times also went straight to a knockout stage. Yet 1954 saw the highest goals per game average of all tournaments, at 5.4!</p>
<p>So the format&#8217;s varied over time, sometimes there were those second group stages, sometimes there weren&#8217;t.  In general, then, I do think you bring up an important point what we would need ideally would be a goals-per-minute total. That&#8217;s a lot of adding up and dividing to do, though!</p>
<p>Plus, I&#8217;d add the format has remained the same since 1998, yet the number of goals will have gone down substantially in three successive World Cups, if 2010 continues its trend.</p>
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		<title>By: Fredrik Stael von Holstein</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24678</link>
		<dc:creator>Fredrik Stael von Holstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 17:01:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24678</guid>
		<description>Thanks Tom, yes... 

Let me clarify my point...

This is the &quot;old way&quot; it used to &quot;work&quot; in the World Cups:

The top two teams in each group would advance to the second round, where they would be split into two groups of four. The winners of each group would play each other in the final, and the second place finishers in the third place match.

However, thesedays, there is a &quot;knock out stage&quot; (with extra time) **directly after the first group stage**... This means that a lot of games go to extra time *already after the first group stage* (add another 30 minutes of football and you will get more goals in the same game!).

So: there is probably more extra time (another 30 minutes) in the &quot;Modern World Cups&quot; - which increases the Goal Average in comparison to the old days...

See my point? We should compare 90 minutes vs. 90 minutes in order to get the right stats!

All the best from Germany!

Fred (Swedish)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Tom, yes&#8230; </p>
<p>Let me clarify my point&#8230;</p>
<p>This is the &#8220;old way&#8221; it used to &#8220;work&#8221; in the World Cups:</p>
<p>The top two teams in each group would advance to the second round, where they would be split into two groups of four. The winners of each group would play each other in the final, and the second place finishers in the third place match.</p>
<p>However, thesedays, there is a &#8220;knock out stage&#8221; (with extra time) **directly after the first group stage**&#8230; This means that a lot of games go to extra time *already after the first group stage* (add another 30 minutes of football and you will get more goals in the same game!).</p>
<p>So: there is probably more extra time (another 30 minutes) in the &#8220;Modern World Cups&#8221; &#8211; which increases the Goal Average in comparison to the old days&#8230;</p>
<p>See my point? We should compare 90 minutes vs. 90 minutes in order to get the right stats!</p>
<p>All the best from Germany!</p>
<p>Fred (Swedish)</p>
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		<title>By: Still Searching For 2010 World Cup Goals: A Historical Comparison &#124; Pitch Invasion</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24676</link>
		<dc:creator>Still Searching For 2010 World Cup Goals: A Historical Comparison &#124; Pitch Invasion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 16:59:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24676</guid>
		<description>[...] I mentioned last week, a decline in the number of goals in the tournament as a whole was, as a continuation of a historical trend in the World Cup finals tournament, only to be [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I mentioned last week, a decline in the number of goals in the tournament as a whole was, as a continuation of a historical trend in the World Cup finals tournament, only to be [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Dunmore</title>
		<link>http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/06/13/where-are-the-world-cup-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-24673</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Dunmore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 16:35:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pitchinvasion.net/?p=10764#comment-24673</guid>
		<description>Fredrik - the 1934 World Cup final went to extra-time, so the rule was introduced by the second World Cup - I&#039;m not sure if the rule existed in 1930, but no knockout games were tied after 90 minutes in any case.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fredrik &#8211; the 1934 World Cup final went to extra-time, so the rule was introduced by the second World Cup &#8211; I&#8217;m not sure if the rule existed in 1930, but no knockout games were tied after 90 minutes in any case.</p>
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