Comments on: Philadelphia, Expansion and the Future of MLS http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/ Exploring football culture around the world Fri, 19 Mar 2010 23:56:38 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Rulo Vinello http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-6493 Rulo Vinello Sat, 07 Feb 2009 11:08:31 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-6493 Very good written. I’ m loving reading these articles , it is such a rich topic, and a great chance for fans to share their knowledge & passion! R.Vinello Very good written. I’ m loving reading these articles , it is such a rich topic, and a great chance for fans to share their knowledge & passion!

R.Vinello

]]> By: vintage all day, SOB’s « D R I N K I N A N D D R O N I N http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-4075 vintage all day, SOB’s « D R I N K I N A N D D R O N I N Tue, 01 Apr 2008 14:57:46 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-4075 [...] other clubs fans will follow Philly, Toronto, Chicago, and others in support. Head over to Pitch Invasion for a more in-depth review of the new [...] [...] other clubs fans will follow Philly, Toronto, Chicago, and others in support. Head over to Pitch Invasion for a more in-depth review of the new [...]

]]> By: Sammy Sounder http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-4034 Sammy Sounder Mon, 31 Mar 2008 09:28:01 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-4034 Know who has a ton of fans in the USL and could be a pretty cool side? Puerto Rico Know who has a ton of fans in the USL and could be a pretty cool side?

Puerto Rico

]]> By: southsidered http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-3545 southsidered Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:19:01 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-3545 Forgot to cite a source for those quotes: http://www.stlouissoccerunited.com/content/view/62/85/ Forgot to cite a source for those quotes:
http://www.stlouissoccerunited.com/content/view/62/85/

]]> By: southsidered http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-3544 southsidered Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:17:02 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-3544 "And will someone please explain to me why on earth MLS is thinking about St. Louis? Missouri already has a football club and they have by far the worst attendance in the league." Some points: 1) The difference in soccer culture between St. Louis and Kansas City is night and day. There is every reason to believe that St. Louis will support an MLS team very well. MLS understands this, as do the dozens of national soccer figures who endorse the St. Louis effort. Some examples: "When the MLS started I can recall thinking why isn’t there a team in St. Louis?" - Tab Ramos "A knowledgeable and passionate fan base, high-quality youth soccer programs, supportive local businesses and political leaders, and robust ethnic communities are what will enable an MLS team to succeed in St. Louis." - Alexi Lalas "I am so happy St. Louis is pursuing this and I would welcome them with open arms into the league." - John Harkes "Back in the early 1990’s St. Louis was the place to be if you wanted to see soccer...I can think of no better place than St. Louis for the next MLS franchise." - Marcelo Balboa "It would be a travesty if this league did not figure out how to put a franchise in the great city of St. Louis...If Major League Soccer is going to do this right, St. Louis must have a team." - Eric Wynalda 2) Kansas City is further away from St. Louis than New York is from Philadelphia. I could just as easily cite the fact that NYRB's attendance is poor to argue against any further expansion teams in that region. But that would make as much sense as your "Missouri" argument: none. I don't know if St. Louis will be the next MLS team, as Don Garber has said MLS wants it to be. But there's a strong case to be made, and the decision-makers are listening. Just because you don't know anything about the situation doesn't make it a bad idea. “And will someone please explain to me why on earth MLS is thinking about St. Louis? Missouri already has a football club and they have by far the worst attendance in the league.”

Some points:

1) The difference in soccer culture between St. Louis and Kansas City is night and day. There is every reason to believe that St. Louis will support an MLS team very well. MLS understands this, as do the dozens of national soccer figures who endorse the St. Louis effort. Some examples:

“When the MLS started I can recall thinking why isn’t there a team in St. Louis?”
- Tab Ramos

“A knowledgeable and passionate fan base, high-quality youth soccer programs, supportive local businesses and political leaders, and robust ethnic communities are what will enable an MLS team to succeed in St. Louis.”
- Alexi Lalas

“I am so happy St. Louis is pursuing this and I would welcome them with open arms into the league.”
- John Harkes

“Back in the early 1990’s St. Louis was the place to be if you wanted to see soccer…I can think of no better place than St. Louis for the next MLS franchise.”
- Marcelo Balboa

“It would be a travesty if this league did not figure out how to put a franchise in the great city of St. Louis…If Major League Soccer is going to do this right, St. Louis must have a team.”
- Eric Wynalda

2) Kansas City is further away from St. Louis than New York is from Philadelphia. I could just as easily cite the fact that NYRB’s attendance is poor to argue against any further expansion teams in that region. But that would make as much sense as your “Missouri” argument: none.

I don’t know if St. Louis will be the next MLS team, as Don Garber has said MLS wants it to be. But there’s a strong case to be made, and the decision-makers are listening. Just because you don’t know anything about the situation doesn’t make it a bad idea.

]]> By: Sean http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-3542 Sean Mon, 10 Mar 2008 08:02:54 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-3542 Thank you, thank you, thank you. I'm so sick of everyone else in the American soccer media saying that expansion is so great -- is it really? It feels very "nasl" all-of-a-sudden, to me. They have done (for the most part) everything right so far; very slow expansion, growing the sport in the cities that actually have teams, etc. And I don't even have a problem with Seattle and Philly coming into the league. But please, please stop there. Why is there an insistence on adding franchises? It's hard enough to get the soccer fans in this country to like the MLS, let alone trying to force anything on anyone. And will someone please explain to me why on earth MLS is thinking about St. Louis? Missouri already has a football club and they have by far the worst attendance in the league. It makes me sick to watch Wizards games on television. The stadium looks like an orange vacuum. How about one more U.S. side (Philly, since we already have Seattle and S.J.) and one more Canadian side (Vancouver or Montreal)? As much as I don't care for Canadian sports fans (I played hockey my entire life (in Michigan) and I've played in some brutal, albeit great, games over the years with the Canadian teams), I think they have proven themselves as worthy MLS supporters (if TFC are any indication). My point is...why Don Garber? You've done a great job, all things considered, to this point...let's continue to use the path of success. To me it's just like learning how to properly change the oil on your car, but doing something entirely different (without knowing if it will work as well) to get the desired effect. I understand the saying "the greatest risk is not taking one" but I've also grown to learn from my mistakes. The NASL was American soccer's mistake. I hope-to-god it is the only one. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I’m so sick of everyone else in the American soccer media saying that expansion is so great — is it really? It feels very “nasl” all-of-a-sudden, to me. They have done (for the most part) everything right so far; very slow expansion, growing the sport in the cities that actually have teams, etc. And I don’t even have a problem with Seattle and Philly coming into the league. But please, please stop there. Why is there an insistence on adding franchises? It’s hard enough to get the soccer fans in this country to like the MLS, let alone trying to force anything on anyone. And will someone please explain to me why on earth MLS is thinking about St. Louis? Missouri already has a football club and they have by far the worst attendance in the league. It makes me sick to watch Wizards games on television. The stadium looks like an orange vacuum. How about one more U.S. side (Philly, since we already have Seattle and S.J.) and one more Canadian side (Vancouver or Montreal)? As much as I don’t care for Canadian sports fans (I played hockey my entire life (in Michigan) and I’ve played in some brutal, albeit great, games over the years with the Canadian teams), I think they have proven themselves as worthy MLS supporters (if TFC are any indication). My point is…why Don Garber? You’ve done a great job, all things considered, to this point…let’s continue to use the path of success. To me it’s just like learning how to properly change the oil on your car, but doing something entirely different (without knowing if it will work as well) to get the desired effect. I understand the saying “the greatest risk is not taking one” but I’ve also grown to learn from my mistakes. The NASL was American soccer’s mistake. I hope-to-god it is the only one.

]]> By: Dubya http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-3363 Dubya Sun, 02 Mar 2008 05:55:32 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-3363 This is, in all honesty, the smartest discussion I've seen regarding MLS's expansion on all the major US soccer blogs. Good job, guys. I've never had such a huge problem with the conferences, so really, whether they go towards a single table or divisions, it's good either way. I can see the benefit of going single table (which MLS has tepidly moved towards with their new, somewhat confusing playoff structure), but the division idea has been proposed by people as famous as Alex Ferguson, so the idea is at least out there, and it could be a decent one. Altogether, I also agree that the cap needs to go up, but its become interesting to see how the teams are trying to expand their academies and scouting operations. DC United, much as I hate them, have done a great job mining the South American market, and seeing other teams branching out to try to repeat their success is a welcome sign that teams are serious about bringing (and hopefully being able to pay for) better talent. An increase in the cap will mean an increase in scouting/signing for those Juan Tojas, who have skill and are willing to come to the States for a decent wage, and to keep those mid-level MLS players here instead of plying their trade in lower European leagues. This is, in all honesty, the smartest discussion I’ve seen regarding MLS’s expansion on all the major US soccer blogs. Good job, guys.

I’ve never had such a huge problem with the conferences, so really, whether they go towards a single table or divisions, it’s good either way. I can see the benefit of going single table (which MLS has tepidly moved towards with their new, somewhat confusing playoff structure), but the division idea has been proposed by people as famous as Alex Ferguson, so the idea is at least out there, and it could be a decent one.

Altogether, I also agree that the cap needs to go up, but its become interesting to see how the teams are trying to expand their academies and scouting operations. DC United, much as I hate them, have done a great job mining the South American market, and seeing other teams branching out to try to repeat their success is a welcome sign that teams are serious about bringing (and hopefully being able to pay for) better talent. An increase in the cap will mean an increase in scouting/signing for those Juan Tojas, who have skill and are willing to come to the States for a decent wage, and to keep those mid-level MLS players here instead of plying their trade in lower European leagues.

]]> By: joejoejoe http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-3347 joejoejoe Sat, 01 Mar 2008 05:27:39 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-3347 I think MLS has more problems with the salary floor than the salary cap. On average MLS pays about what 4th tier League Two players (aprox. $98K) make in England and significantly less than 2nd tier Serie B in Italy (aprox. $275K per Reppublica.it) or 2nd tier Championship in England ($387K per BBC). Major League Soccer pays minor league wages. A higher cap might lead to 3 David Beckhams per team and a backline filled with players making $40,000 per year. I read somewhere that League Two has a voluntary salary cap that limits wages to 60% of turnover. Does anyone know what percentage MLS pays in wages? I think MLS has more problems with the salary floor than the salary cap. On average MLS pays about what 4th tier League Two players (aprox. $98K) make in England and significantly less than 2nd tier Serie B in Italy (aprox. $275K per Reppublica.it) or 2nd tier Championship in England ($387K per BBC). Major League Soccer pays minor league wages. A higher cap might lead to 3 David Beckhams per team and a backline filled with players making $40,000 per year.

I read somewhere that League Two has a voluntary salary cap that limits wages to 60% of turnover. Does anyone know what percentage MLS pays in wages?

]]> By: Davyd T http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-3345 Davyd T Sat, 01 Mar 2008 01:53:01 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-3345 Micah it sounds simple enough, but you are forgetting the greed factor. With expansion fees already at $30 million and i assume going up, owners of the existing team would love to expand even more and make some money. And I agree two more teams; to make it an 18 team top league would be great. Montreal should be one of thus two, as it makes sense from the geographic point of view. Micah it sounds simple enough, but you are forgetting the greed factor. With expansion fees already at $30 million and i assume going up, owners of the existing team would love to expand even more and make some money.
And I agree two more teams; to make it an 18 team top league would be great. Montreal should be one of thus two, as it makes sense from the geographic point of view.

]]> By: Micah http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/comment-page-1/#comment-3343 Micah Sat, 01 Mar 2008 00:20:40 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2008/02/28/philadelphia-expansion-and-the-future-of-mls/#comment-3343 I would say give St. Louis a club and then throw in one more to even out the table. Then call it quits for awhile. Perhaps smaller metro areas should look to form USL clubs to help spread soccer in states where there is no MLS side. One day I'd love to see a viable promotion/relegation system working in the States. Also, raise the damn cap! I would say give St. Louis a club and then throw in one more to even out the table. Then call it quits for awhile. Perhaps smaller metro areas should look to form USL clubs to help spread soccer in states where there is no MLS side. One day I’d love to see a viable promotion/relegation system working in the States.

Also, raise the damn cap!

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