Comments on: Is Globalisation Good for Soccer? http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/ Exploring football culture around the world. Fri, 10 Oct 2008 22:21:55 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: Robin http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-4857 Robin Thu, 29 May 2008 15:17:59 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-4857 Pietro makes one good point but misses another - yes, we want the local connection, but it's a connection to the FANS and CLUB not the TEAM and individual PLAYERS. I've been a Spurs fan for decades (since the 60s), but I couldn't tell you where a single one of the players came from. I admire individual players, but their origin is just about irrelevant and has been for a very long time I'm a fan with other fans - we went to games together (when I was in the UK) - and supported the team together. So the local connection is around the club, not the nationality or origin of the players. Pietro makes one good point but misses another - yes, we want the local connection, but it’s a connection to the FANS and CLUB not the TEAM and individual PLAYERS. I’ve been a Spurs fan for decades (since the 60s), but I couldn’t tell you where a single one of the players came from. I admire individual players, but their origin is just about irrelevant and has been for a very long time

I’m a fan with other fans - we went to games together (when I was in the UK) - and supported the team together.

So the local connection is around the club, not the nationality or origin of the players.

]]> By: pietro http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-2207 pietro Wed, 16 Jan 2008 17:48:07 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-2207 It seems that most people have no understanding of what it means to be a fan. The reason sports has always given meaning and excitement to fans is not just the skills they are watching. But more importantly it is a feeling of connection with the team and players. Why do most people support their local teams? Because it represents your area and your community. Now if the team is made up of no local players there is a disconnection. If I know that at least some of the players are local youth it will make the sport that much more interesting to me and I would guess many other fans. Sapp Blatter's proposal to have a quota system is a good balance and it strengthens the historic ties fans traditionally held with their players, many of whom were local talent. That is more important to me than fielding a team that is made up of superstars who have not the first clue what the club means to means to the fans. I would rather lose with local talent, people I know or have a connection with, than win with players who are on the team because of money and nothing else. It seems that most people have no understanding of what it means to be a fan. The reason sports has always given meaning and excitement to fans is not just the skills they are watching. But more importantly it is a feeling of connection with the team and players. Why do most people support their local teams? Because it represents your area and your community. Now if the team is made up of no local players there is a disconnection. If I know that at least some of the players are local youth it will make the sport that much more interesting to me and I would guess many other fans. Sapp Blatter’s proposal to have a quota system is a good balance and it strengthens the historic ties fans traditionally held with their players, many of whom were local talent. That is more important to me than fielding a team that is made up of superstars who have not the first clue what the club means to means to the fans. I would rather lose with local talent, people I know or have a connection with, than win with players who are on the team because of money and nothing else.

]]> By: BoB http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-571 BoB Wed, 31 Oct 2007 21:17:50 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-571 I think its clearly a problem especially when you have nations like Brazil who further the problem by shopping their national team around the world rather than playing friendlies at home. But you'll never see quotas in the Premier League teams like Arsenal have too much power and foreign talent to accept some sort of 5 English starters rule. Not to mention I've already seen disgruntled quotes by foreigners (don't remember who) that play in the PL saying how unfair it would be. Actually I believe even Moritz Volz stated his unhappiness with the idea, understandably so. Like you said as a fan of a weaker league its hard to celebrate globalization even when we see both sides of it. Some of America's best homegrown are parading about in Fulham and elsewhere while some of the best in our league are Mexican, Colombian, and Brazilian. So when I think of it I find it hard to complain too greatly. But I believe MLS is in the middle of the global soccer pyramid. Good enough to serve as a launching pad for unrecognized talent but not good enough to pay potential greats. It boils down to capitalism I suppose, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. But I've said my part and I'm just repeating now so I look forward to what others have to say. I think its clearly a problem especially when you have nations like Brazil who further the problem by shopping their national team around the world rather than playing friendlies at home. But you’ll never see quotas in the Premier League teams like Arsenal have too much power and foreign talent to accept some sort of 5 English starters rule. Not to mention I’ve already seen disgruntled quotes by foreigners (don’t remember who) that play in the PL saying how unfair it would be. Actually I believe even Moritz Volz stated his unhappiness with the idea, understandably so.

Like you said as a fan of a weaker league its hard to celebrate globalization even when we see both sides of it. Some of America’s best homegrown are parading about in Fulham and elsewhere while some of the best in our league are Mexican, Colombian, and Brazilian. So when I think of it I find it hard to complain too greatly. But I believe MLS is in the middle of the global soccer pyramid. Good enough to serve as a launching pad for unrecognized talent but not good enough to pay potential greats.

It boils down to capitalism I suppose, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. But I’ve said my part and I’m just repeating now so I look forward to what others have to say.

]]> By: Thomas Dunmore http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-570 Thomas Dunmore Wed, 31 Oct 2007 21:07:54 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-570 Joe, all good points. One thing I like about MLS is that being a supporter still has a community feel to it, with everything being more accessible, compared to the alien insanity of the Premiership. Mark, those are remarkable numbers for just one year. By the way, was that on the World Football phone-in? That show is very good, especially compared to every other phone-in on BBC Five Live. Joe, all good points. One thing I like about MLS is that being a supporter still has a community feel to it, with everything being more accessible, compared to the alien insanity of the Premiership.

Mark, those are remarkable numbers for just one year. By the way, was that on the World Football phone-in? That show is very good, especially compared to every other phone-in on BBC Five Live.

]]> By: Mark http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-569 Mark Wed, 31 Oct 2007 20:32:09 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-569 for what its worth, I heard on the BBC World Football podcast, that Brazil had a net loss of 500 professional players last year. Something close to 1000 moved abroad, while about 500 came back to Brazil. Go Maroons! for what its worth, I heard on the BBC World Football podcast, that Brazil had a net loss of 500 professional players last year. Something close to 1000 moved abroad, while about 500 came back to Brazil.

Go Maroons!

]]> By: Joe http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-568 Joe Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:55:42 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-568 I think it's impossible to answer the question "Is Globalisation Good for Soccer?". We rarely (if ever) think of football as a whole, rather just our own country, league or club. Whilst globalisation probably works well for the Premier League, La Liga and the Champions League, it's obviouly not so good for clubs at the bottom end of the football pyramid. I don't think there will ever be a single development that benefits everyone in the game. We often talk about the widening gaps between the big clubs and their smaller counterparts, even in the same league. So perhaps in the future people will make a clear divide between clubs they want to watch to enjoy the experience, and those they want to watch to enjoy the quality of football. Isn't it interesting that those sides who emphasise an enjoyable experience due to their roots in the local community (see St.Pauli, Barcelona and even Toronto FC) are the ones who receive a lot of positive press. Meanwhile clubs at the highest level can play badly for a few weeks suddenly receive criticism from all angles. The end result of globalisation of football will be that when certain clubs have their supernova in the Champions League and eventually fade away, they'll realise that the only thing that keeps them going is the support of the everyday fan, not the countless millions enjoying their "product". It's when a club can harness this support (Liverpool, Barcelona, Bayern Munich) that they can really challenge over decades rather than seasons. I think it’s impossible to answer the question “Is Globalisation Good for Soccer?”. We rarely (if ever) think of football as a whole, rather just our own country, league or club.

Whilst globalisation probably works well for the Premier League, La Liga and the Champions League, it’s obviouly not so good for clubs at the bottom end of the football pyramid. I don’t think there will ever be a single development that benefits everyone in the game.

We often talk about the widening gaps between the big clubs and their smaller counterparts, even in the same league. So perhaps in the future people will make a clear divide between clubs they want to watch to enjoy the experience, and those they want to watch to enjoy the quality of football.

Isn’t it interesting that those sides who emphasise an enjoyable experience due to their roots in the local community (see St.Pauli, Barcelona and even Toronto FC) are the ones who receive a lot of positive press. Meanwhile clubs at the highest level can play badly for a few weeks suddenly receive criticism from all angles.

The end result of globalisation of football will be that when certain clubs have their supernova in the Champions League and eventually fade away, they’ll realise that the only thing that keeps them going is the support of the everyday fan, not the countless millions enjoying their “product”. It’s when a club can harness this support (Liverpool, Barcelona, Bayern Munich) that they can really challenge over decades rather than seasons.

]]> By: Thomas Dunmore http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-567 Thomas Dunmore Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:09:57 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-567 That all sounds logical enough on its own grounds (though I'm no expert, despite my presence at the University of Chicago, where Drezner himself failed to win tenure), but I don't want to consider this only in economic terms, nor do I expect or want a hearing from economists. Your last paragraph makes the point nicely, though. That all sounds logical enough on its own grounds (though I’m no expert, despite my presence at the University of Chicago, where Drezner himself failed to win tenure), but I don’t want to consider this only in economic terms, nor do I expect or want a hearing from economists.

Your last paragraph makes the point nicely, though.

]]> By: Antonio G http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-566 Antonio G Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:41:32 +0000 http://pitchinvasion.net/2007/10/31/is-globalisation-good-for-soccer/#comment-566 Stick with the economic terms: you're comparing the value of football on TV, which in economic terms is a "non-rival good" (anybody can watch it at virtually no marginal cost), versus the value of watching football in person which is very definitely a "rival good" (which only a limited number of people can do). The only way, in economic terms, that you can think the latter is superior to the former is if you believe you are one of the lucky ones who are going to have preferential access to the rival good. You could, I suppose, get all Benthamite about this and argue that the hedonic value of the rival good is so much greater than that of the non-rival good that, on aggregate, the value of the former is greater than the latter. But I wouldn't count on getting much of a hearing on that from economists. Stick with the economic terms: you’re comparing the value of football on TV, which in economic terms is a “non-rival good” (anybody can watch it at virtually no marginal cost), versus the value of watching football in person which is very definitely a “rival good” (which only a limited number of people can do).

The only way, in economic terms, that you can think the latter is superior to the former is if you believe you are one of the lucky ones who are going to have preferential access to the rival good.

You could, I suppose, get all Benthamite about this and argue that the
hedonic value of the rival good is so much greater than that of the non-rival good that, on aggregate, the value of the former is greater than the latter. But I wouldn’t count on getting much of a hearing on that from economists.

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